Legal advice about evicting someone from a house.

[Kurosaki]

There's probably a better thread title I could have used but here we are. I'm going to keep a long story short, as best I can, but include pertinent details.

My brother's girlfriend kicked him out of her apartment (his name wasn't on the lease) and he is back at our mom's house for now. Mom wants him out because he's being a toxic shithead. He also has his dog with him. The dog is a puppy but it's untrained, is a nuisance that bothers her constantly, pisses on her carpets, and he obviously cannot keep it under control. He is almost 40, has burned all of the bridges with other friends and has no where else to go.

What can my mother do to get him out of the house? Legally?

She is worried just calling the cops won't be enough. Because my brother will explain the situation as if she NEEDS him there to take care of her. That is not true but he is an incredible wordsmith and narcissist that will say and do anything if it benefits him. Mom just wants him gone.

What are her options? Legally? If she calls the police, should I be there to corroborate her story? So far, talking to with her day to day she agrees my presence there isn't going to help anything and potentially probably would make things worse because me and him are like water and oil. He is desperate and will start a fight out of nowhere.

 

[BillSmith]

You've heard of the Hatfields and the McCoys?

They're nothing compared with two sore Kurosaki's.

Legally, believe he has to be evicted. Complicated process.

Before you do/discuss anything with brother, sit down and document everything. Write it down. Type it out. In language that is clear, contrite and legalese in nature to communicate with various authorities.

Initially, in a family discussion, explain to brother why he must go. By your depiction here, it won't work, but is the first necessary step in process.

Is there another sibling or family member that could take your place as arbiter and/or corroborating witness?

If he has legal issues, use `em to get him booted.

The best method? Get him a new girlfriend.

 

[cheez]

Has she asked him to leave?

Eviction is a nasty process that involves the Sheriff's Dept. in most cases.

If she hasn't said to him "I don't want you living here anymore, I need you to find a new place to live" I'd start there.

Secondly, agree with Bill, document it all, present in paper if asking doesn't work. Look up a "Notice To Quit" and prepare one of those.

Then, yeah, call the Sheriff.

This seemed informative: https://www.yourlegalcorner.com/articles.asp?id=178&cat=land

 

[afm199]

If your mom is elderly, she can get in contact with local senior services, including help with family who are abusing a senior. It's her house, and it doesn't matter what your brother says, unless he's legally a conservator, he has no rights in what your mother does. She has to stand up to him. The cops don't get to make that decision, nor want to.

Or get a senior lawyer.

 

[ST Guy]

Sounds like elder abuse to me.

 

[bojangle]

The moral of the story is, be careful who you allow to live in your house.

How long has he lived there? Does he have his stuff there? A house key? Sounds like he has likely established residency at your mom's house, regardless of a lack of a contract, not on lease, or not paying any rent. There are only three ways to get him out of the house.

1) He moves out voluntarily. If that happens, she should make him remove all his stuff, collect the keys, and maybe even change the locks. Then, do not let him move back in.

2) Go through an eviction process. Evictions are ultimately handled by the Sheriff's Office, but there is a lot of requirements and paperwork ahead of time, and it can take 30 to 60 days to complete...possibly a lot longer due to covid, but I'm thinking that's not such a factor anymore. Everything has to be done correctly, or the timeline could be reset.

3) Get a restraining order. There would have to be sufficient grounds for a restraining order, and in order for the court to order the restrained party to move out of the house likely requires a violent crime, or at least the threat of violence. If it was just a civil harassment order against a son living in the house, I'm betting the court would allow him to remain, and order peaceful contact, or maybe no contact, but no stay away or move out orders.

If the police were called to the scene, they will likely tell your mom about the same. The police will not force a resident to leave their house. They can't legally do this. Only the sheriff can do this, and only following a legal eviction.

 

[SFMCjohn]

your mom’s county probably has a restraining order clinic, that may be a responsive place to help start getting a game plan together.

there’s probably also an eviction clinic that might be helpful given her circumstance, although I think because they are “closely related” the RO route might be much more simple and effective?

I think of the eviction process as being primarily for disputes between relative strangers, i.e. roommates, landlord/tenants, and in practice really to protect a landlord’s business interests. if I thought I could avoid the eviction system, I’d certainly try to avoid it, and instead use a system that’s more designed to protect my mother’s interests in being free of threats to her mental health?

not sure why I think you’re in Sacramento County (train thread?), but here’s an example of restraining order help.

I wouldn’t bother the police unless I at least had a TRO or a piece of court paperwork to help the police know how to respond.

idk, but think threats of violence against mom’s guests would be enough? the California Judicial Council form DV-500-INFO might be a quick thing to look at ... it describes the violence/threats requirements for a DV-RO, and it even seems like the dog thing might qualify under “Disturbing your peace”?

+1 on looking to the county’s Adult Services Department, too.

anyway, DV-RO is a legal way, between family, and a ton of DV resources, of course, but idk, and will defer to my betters.

sorry you have to deal with this, sounds stressful.

 

[NorCalBusa]

Or handle it vastly cheaper the street way, without saying a word;
- return all incoming USPS mail to him marked "Moved", for a month
- take all his shit to the dump
- change the locks/alarm code
- Mom, don't ever let him set foot on the property, even the lawn or driveway

Fini.

 

[bojangle]

First I'll address the title of the thread. Only an attorney can give the OP legal advice on what to do. All any of the rest of us can do is to explain legal options in our best understanding.

Or handle it vastly cheaper the street way, without saying a word;
- return all incoming USPS mail to him marked "Moved", for a month
- take all his shit to the dump
- change the locks/alarm code
- Mom, don't ever let him set foot on the property, even the lawn or driveway

Fini.

Having said that, the LEO forum is for passing along lawful advice and explanations. This would not be good advice to follow, nor would it be a lawful way to proceed.

 

[tuxumino]

Has she asked him to leave?

Eviction is a nasty process that involves the Sheriff's Dept. in most cases.

If she hasn't said to him "I don't want you living here anymore, I need you to find a new place to live" I'd start there.

Secondly, agree with Bill, document it all, present in paper if asking doesn't work. Look up a "Notice To Quit" and prepare one of those.

Then, yeah, call the Sheriff.

This seemed informative: https://www.yourlegalcorner.com/articles.asp?id=178&cat=land

+1

you'll probably need a lawyer too

 

[NorCalBusa]

Here's something a bit more creative. For any method to work, your Mom has to agree of course and remain committed to keeping him out or it starts all over. That's a big deal.

Perhaps then a better way is a "friendly eviction"- pay him to move out. For this, he needs to be desperate for money of course and that condition isn't indicated in your post.

Here's how that would work;
- Have an attorney prepare a binding agreement that in exchange for a fixed amount of money (sufficient to motivate him, but less than a whole legal process and taking into account the pain in the ass it would be)
- He agrees to move out by a certain date
- The money he can use for whatever purpose- like first/last/deposit on a new place, cost of moving- all his call- but help him see it as a solution
- Not a dime is paid until he is out
- It also states that he's out and isn't welcome back (this will be hard on Mom, so getting her to see the value here is important)
- Once he agrees, signed, returned his key and moved out- pay him.
- Change the locks, alarm code, etc. right away, take pics of the empty room.

Presenting the idea needs to be tactful and solution oriented, emphasize the aspects that would most appeal to him. Consider concurrently pursuing more conventional avenues as mentioned, as he could bail on this notion at the last minute. Good luck.

 

[CRUZer]

^ I manage hundreds of residential properties and that approach is known as "cash for keys" in the industry. It's usually the quickest and cheapest alternative to an eviction. The squatting type usually have two things in common: they're always hard up for cash and they're missing the delayed gratification gene, which usually makes the "cash for keys" approach a win-win for both parties.

 

[bojangle]

Here's something a bit more creative. For any method to work, your Mom has to agree of course and remain committed to keeping him out or it starts all over. That's a big deal.

Perhaps then a better way is a "friendly eviction"- pay him to move out. For this, he needs to be desperate for money of course and that condition isn't indicated in your post.

Here's how that would work;
- Have an attorney prepare a binding agreement that in exchange for a fixed amount of money (sufficient to motivate him, but less than a whole legal process and taking into account the pain in the ass it would be)
- He agrees to move out by a certain date
- The money he can use for whatever purpose- like first/last/deposit on a new place, cost of moving- all his call- but help him see it as a solution
- Not a dime is paid until he is out
- It also states that he's out and isn't welcome back (this will be hard on Mom, so getting her to see the value here is important)
- Once he agrees, signed, returned his key and moved out- pay him.
- Change the locks, alarm code, etc. right away, take pics of the empty room.

Presenting the idea needs to be tactful and solution oriented, emphasize the aspects that would most appeal to him. Consider concurrently pursuing more conventional avenues as mentioned, as he could bail on this notion at the last minute. Good luck.

This is a good idea. It is legal and it falls in the # 1 category, which is basically that he's moving out voluntarily. If he agrees and follows through, it's probably the cheapest and easiest way.

But yeah, mom has to be totally on board about making him leave and not letting him move back in. That can be tough for a parent. Often times, it seems, the parent landlord of the pain in the ass adult can be their own worst enemy.

 

[cheez]

This is a good idea. It is legal and it falls in the # 1 category, which is basically that he's moving out voluntarily. If he agrees and follows through, it's probably the cheapest and easiest way.

But yeah, mom has to be totally on board about making him leave and not letting him move back in. That can be tough for a parent. Often times, it seems, the parent landlord of the pain in the ass adult can be their own worst enemy.

Quick aside about how tough parents can be.

My youngest brother is adopted, he was emotionally tortured for years by his birth mother (also my foster sister) who finally abandoned him to go off and be a druggie at the age of 17 (had him at 13) but kept tormenting him through his childhood. My parents (mom and stepdad) legally adopted him at age seven to keep him out of the foster system. He wound up depressed and started using drugs at a really young age (like 13) and would steal anything and everything to get drug money. He became very violent and would have angry, violent outbreaks that resulted in the police being called and, a couple of times, his being arrested by them for various reasons (warrants, outbursts, he swung on my stepdad as the unit was rolling up, etc.) Finally when he turned 18 my mom asked him to move out, but he never would- he'd leave for a month or three, but then come back.

They got a restraining order, but he kept coming back. I finally confronted my mother about it and she admitted she kept inviting him to come back home "because he didn't have anywhere else to stay, and it's cold outside." This went on until he was 21, her letting him come back to the house, him stealing anything and everything of value, my stepdad getting angry with her, him eventually leaving. Finally stepdad had convinced her not to let him back in- so she lets him into the garage to sleep in her car. He decides to shoot up heroin in the car, gets high, gets out of the car, and starts playing with his cigarette lighter near the gas cans stored in the garage for the lawn equipment. Somehow, the house catches on fire at 4:30am and burns down; my mom and stepdad, room on the second floor above the garage, barely make it out; stepdad has permanent burn scars. Brother is present the next morning when the FD is finishing putting out the fire, brags to someone in earshot of the FD that he did it, winds up arrested, charged with arson, and in jail for three months. Is tried, convicted, and serves a few months, but COVID comes around and they release him.

My mother invited him to her new apartment, let him in the door, let him stay for two days, and it took my stepdad catching him shooting heroin in the bathroom before she'd let the police be called to remove him (he's 6'3" and not weak, and they're older and frail.)

Parents are unpredictable, emotional, and willing to throw their own lives away for their children. If you believe his presence there is harming your mother, and she is unwilling to take action, it may be necessary that you intercede on her behalf for her own good. Good luck with the situation.

 

[bojangle]

^^^Crap! That story sure drives the point home.

 

[jdhu]

^^^Crap! That story sure drives the point home.

LOL +1, so thankful I don't have children...

 

[Kurosaki]

Everyone, I appreciate your responses. I have some questions to answer for some of you and information to update that will help further advice.

Had a long weekend and pretty busy with work today still so far.

Just wanted to acknowledge I've read your advice but haven't had much time to give a response.

 

[Kurosaki]

Just as an update, my brother is moving to some apartment somewhere tomorrow, supposedly. I'll believe when I see it.

The last week or so, until this, he had been 'docile' and 'apologetic' for the monster he had been in the house before. I didn't believe any of that, and told mom the whole time, not a genuine introspection but someone running out of options. The untrained dog that still pisses everywhere in her house was her main concern. I apologize for those that gave me advice in this thread or wanted more information before advising more. A lot of you helped me but one big shout out to JDHU, (for his advice privately. That helped her a lot, to not get to a point of using the different options and necessary processes available to her.) But all of you helped.

Parents are unpredictable, emotional, and willing to throw their own lives away for their children. If you believe his presence there is harming your mother, and she is unwilling to take action, it may be necessary that you intercede on her behalf for her own good. Good luck with the situation.

Dan, I thank you for sharing the story of your siblings and family. It takes balls to express family history this openly ask around here. I was getting to the point of having to take necessary action for her own good but *cross fingers* hope what happens tomorrow is as planned.

I'll be content, but not really, when I get a call or a text that says "he's gone."

 

[bojangle]

Just as an update, my brother is moving to some apartment somewhere tomorrow, supposedly. I'll believe when I see it.

The last week or so, until this, he had been 'docile' and 'apologetic' for the monster he had been in the house before. I didn't believe any of that, and told mom the whole time, not a genuine introspection but someone running out of options. The untrained dog that still pisses everywhere in her house was her main concern. I apologize for those that gave me advice in this thread or wanted more information before advising more. A lot of you helped me but one big shout out to JDHU, (for his advice privately. That helped her a lot, to not get to a point of using the different options and necessary processes available to her.) But all of you helped.



Dan, I thank you for sharing the story of your siblings and family. It takes balls to express family history this openly ask around here. I was getting to the point of having to take necessary action for her own good but *cross fingers* hope what happens tomorrow is as planned.

I'll be content, but not really, when I get a call or a text that says "he's gone."

If he actually moves out and into a new place, your mom should immediately change the locks. I'd even recommend delivering him any belongings left behind to get him completely out of the house. Then, she needs to show tough love and not let him move back in. If he tries down the road, don't open the door, and call the police, would be my advice.

If he doesn't move out like he agreed to, she can't change the locks and lock him out. She must wait until it's a done deal.

I wish JDHU had posted his advice up here for the benefit of everyone else.

 

[cheez]

Dan, I thank you for sharing the story of your siblings and family. It takes balls to express family history this openly ask around here. I was getting to the point of having to take necessary action for her own good but *cross fingers* hope what happens tomorrow is as planned.

I'll be content, but not really, when I get a call or a text that says "he's gone."

I'm pretty open with the facts of my life, brother. If sharing my story of "I should've intervened earlier" helps you manage the situation with your mom/brother better, it's worth taking whatever hazing lesser folks care to fling my way. I'm glad it seems to be working out ok.