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First ride, first crash. Sorry OFG....
- Thread starter Larell
- Start date
OldFatGuy
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The Duke has less horsepower than an SV650, which is commonly recommended as a good beginner bike. It also has a broad, torquey (not peaky) powerband that's easy to ride. In general, it's a pretty forgiving bike compared to pretty much anything out there, besides maybe a Ninja 250 (which not everybody wants to ride and which has lots of breakable bodywork). The issue here is NOT the bike. The OP made an error, or series of errors which have already been discussed. As long as he can learn from the experience, I think he'll be just fine.
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JDMPenn
NG
Yeah, I've never done a wheelie on accident on my first bike (02 R6) but I've done something similar (too much throttle; close throttle; too much again). The key to that is just to be as smooth as possible on both. Just gotta learn how your bike operates; many are different. Be safe.
TurboTiger
New member
Definitely practice your clutch and friction zone skills. Even if it's in your driveway (if it's big enough).
One thing most people don't tell you, the easiest way (not always the best) is once you find yourself in the middle of the friction zone, don't move the clutch anymore (pause releasing the clutch lever) and roll on the throttle slowly. It sounds like you're both releasing the clutch lever too fast and rolling on too much throttle. Slow both down.
One thing most people don't tell you, the easiest way (not always the best) is once you find yourself in the middle of the friction zone, don't move the clutch anymore (pause releasing the clutch lever) and roll on the throttle slowly. It sounds like you're both releasing the clutch lever too fast and rolling on too much throttle. Slow both down.
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Reminder: The Crash Analysis Forum was created with the intent of helping people learn from mistakes. The discussion should be centered around mental and physical skills that motorcyclists can use to avoid similar situations.
The following statements are not realistic or productive:
"sell your bike and get something smaller, slower, etc."
"Go buy a dirtbike and practice in the dirt for a few years before riding on the street"
"Ride your own ride"
Shouldn't we be providing the OP (and readers) specific skills that they can easily understand, and immediately apply when they ride (and drive) again?
The following statements are not realistic or productive:
"sell your bike and get something smaller, slower, etc."
"Go buy a dirtbike and practice in the dirt for a few years before riding on the street"
"Ride your own ride"
Shouldn't we be providing the OP (and readers) specific skills that they can easily understand, and immediately apply when they ride (and drive) again?
Totally disagree. There's too much torque. A 640cc Duke II Supermoto is not a beginner bike. Its a wheelie machine with a light front end. He's already proven that one slip of the wrist spells disaster. I bought my 17 year old a Husky 250TE to ride on the street and he's an experience rider with years of fast technical offroading behind him. He can still go 75mph on the street when he wants but a throttle screw up or misshift is less likely to get him into trouble. He can easily ride my 525 and my 990R, but I know he's new on the street and likely to have a brain fart. Its about being on a forgiving bike until your throttle control, street awareness and accident avoidance skills become second nature. I see too many new street riders crash in the first year because they have no experience using a throttle or a clutch. A new rider needs to develop some muscle memory so the need to "think" about the bikes controls won't lead to a mistake. Personally I would never let anyone in my family ride on the street until they were reasonably competent in the dirt or on a closed track. By the way my son took the mandatory safety training to get his license and couldn't believe how poor some of the new riders were.
motomanfan
New member
I could not disagree more regarding the dirtbike advice. Been riding and racing dirt and street most of my life. Having the dirt experience, I can tell you that my recomendation for him to practice in the dirt FIRST is THE BEST ADVICE anyone can ever give him. PERIOD. You can debate whether his street bike is too torquey, too fast, too this and too that. But there is no debating the fact that gaining skill and confidence in the dirt is THE BEST thing he could ever do for learning to ride and stay alive in the street.
motomanfan
New member
BTW- my original post where I recommended that he practice in the dirt first has been deleted. Is that standard protocal here on BARF....someone sees a post that they dont agree with and delete it??
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You are completely missing the point. I agree that dirtbike experience is valuable and useful. The issue here is that most riders do not have the ability to spend $1k or more for a dirtbike, $500 or more for the gear, and $2K or more for a transport vehicle.
Can you give them advice they can use immediately, advice that doesn't require a large financial investment?
BTW- my original post where I recommended that he practice in the dirt first has been deleted. Is that standard protocal here on BARF....someone sees a post that they dont agree with and delete it??
No, it's standard practice in the Crash Analysis Forum. If it isn't analysis of the crash, it doesn't fit in the CA forum.
motomanfan
New member
Disagree: It is advice that he can do now. He can pick up a beater for next to nothing, he could sell his bike (that is obviously too much for him at this stage) and get a dirt bike and a more suitable street bike for what he could get for his current bike, etc, etc, etc,.
Anyways, I think my advice was appropriate; I analized his crash and gave him my advice. He can take it or leave it. But deleting my post was:
on your part. Just sayin'
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Disagree: It is advice that he can do now. He can pick up a beater for next to nothing, he could sell his bike (that is obviously too much for him at this stage) and get a dirt bike and a more suitable street bike for what he could get for his current bike, etc, etc, etc,.
Anyways, I think my advice was appropriate; I analized his crash and gave him my advice. He can take it or leave it. But deleting my post was:
No, you didn't analyze his crash. You told him to get a dirtbike.
Are you able to provide him with some advice that he can use immediately, like in the next 10 minutes, if he chose to ride right now?
motomanfan
New member
I analized his deatails of his crash, limited experience, the fact that he crashed on his first ride, etc and concluded that the best advice I could give him is to find some way of borrowing a dirt bike, buying one, whatever, and practice in that environment. Its the same advice I gave a family member who did the same thing. He took my advice and since become a very competent and safe rider on the street.I've been a part of many riding forums in my life and find it unfortunate when moderators "OVER MODERATE" by deleting things that dont fit into their ideas of what is a valid answer.
My advice is completely valid and could be very helpful. But not if moderators delete it
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OK, you may have analyzed the crash, but you did not share that here.
I understand your opinion, but it doesn't fit in with the rules of the Crash Analysis Forum.
Let's make the assumption that the OP does not have the $ to go purchase a dirtbike. Are you able to give him some advice that he can use immediately?
I understand your opinion, but it doesn't fit in with the rules of the Crash Analysis Forum.
Let's make the assumption that the OP does not have the $ to go purchase a dirtbike. Are you able to give him some advice that he can use immediately?
motomanfan
New member
Yes. My advice would be the same as I tell my kids: PATIENCE IS A VIRTUE. If he cant afford it now. Then WAIT til he can get a d.bike before he jumps back on his street bike. It may save him and someone else a lot of misery.
Cant escape the fact that this is sound advice that should not have been deleted. Others have given other great advice along the lines of what you say fit the RULES of this crash forum. I just simply added another solution. A solution that again, is sound advice. If it doesnt match the RULES of this forum, then the rules should be re-evaluated
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It is good advice that does not help him now. It is good advice that doesn't analyze the crash. It is good advice that doesn't fit here.
I let this discussion continue here to hopefully help the OP, you, and other readers understand what fits in CA and what doesn't. Future posts that do not analyze the crash, or do not provide advice that readers can immediately apply, will continue to be deleted.
Telling Ain't Training.
I let this discussion continue here to hopefully help the OP, you, and other readers understand what fits in CA and what doesn't. Future posts that do not analyze the crash, or do not provide advice that readers can immediately apply, will continue to be deleted.
Telling Ain't Training.
Glad the OP is ok and looking for advice. I'm not quite sure what to add that hasn't been already covered other than if you know how to drive a manual transmission car, even though the controls are actuated with different body parts, the concept is the same. I taught my wife how to ride using much reference of a car and how she drives it. IDK, maybe that will help.
(Post 47 which also addresses riding on dirt first)
Older used dirt bikes are, well if you pardon the pun, dirt cheap. A level vacant lot, dirt bike and normal street apparel is more than enough to practice launching, shifting and more.
Interesting, I read the stickies and the best I got was:
The suggestion is not out of line with other posts.
I learned and got comfortable with the motorcycle's controls and feel of riding, on a private lot on a dirt bike. Later, I graduated to an empty school black top on a street bike that was really too nig and heavy for me at the time.
I agree with the opinion even though it's not the only option. Practice practice practice.
Wasn't there a post or three about changing what bike to ride?
(Post 47 which also addresses riding on dirt first)Older used dirt bikes are, well if you pardon the pun, dirt cheap. A level vacant lot, dirt bike and normal street apparel is more than enough to practice launching, shifting and more.
Interesting, I read the stickies and the best I got was:
Seems any discussion about how to avoid this in the future, is not in the rules of the forum. Discussion on how to improve one's skills as he/she gains experience on a motorcycle AFTER THE CRASH has been going on uncontested before the suggestion of buying a dirt bike. Evidently suggesting other streetable bikes is ok, just not a dirt bike
The suggestion is not out of line with other posts.I learned and got comfortable with the motorcycle's controls and feel of riding, on a private lot on a dirt bike. Later, I graduated to an empty school black top on a street bike that was really too nig and heavy for me at the time.
I agree with the opinion even though it's not the only option. Practice practice practice.
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If the post contains some sort advice on how to build skill that has a direct correlation to the crash itself, then it will be left in place, even if there is other information there.
Assuming that poor throttle and clutch control resulted in this crash, what does "go practice on a dirtbike" mean? The OP would have crashed in the same manner. (The injuries may have been less, but that isn't what the CA Forum is about.) What specific skill should the OP practice if they had access to a dirtbike? That is the point here. Bad skills are bad skills no matter what bike someone is riding.
The CA Forum is intended to address the specific skill(s), mental and physical, that will help the OP should he find himself in a similar situation in the future. Without giving the OP a specific skill to practice, what are they to take away from the discussion? What shall they practice, what is it that indicates improvement?
Let's discuss skills not the type of motorcycle.
Assuming that poor throttle and clutch control resulted in this crash, what does "go practice on a dirtbike" mean? The OP would have crashed in the same manner. (The injuries may have been less, but that isn't what the CA Forum is about.) What specific skill should the OP practice if they had access to a dirtbike? That is the point here. Bad skills are bad skills no matter what bike someone is riding.
The CA Forum is intended to address the specific skill(s), mental and physical, that will help the OP should he find himself in a similar situation in the future. Without giving the OP a specific skill to practice, what are they to take away from the discussion? What shall they practice, what is it that indicates improvement?
Let's discuss skills not the type of motorcycle.
Really?
Sorry, couldn't let it go. I think I have made my point. Done. Good luck to the OP
looks like we need to work on moderating consistency and double standards. These don't seem to fall within your guidelines. Just sayin'You know, that applies to so many things in life.
Sorry, couldn't let it go. I think I have made my point. Done. Good luck to the OP
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