Supermoto choices... Steer me the right way.

[chai rome]

I’ve considered all sorts of sumos; from wr250x, to klx300sm, to husky 450/510, to berg fs570, to ktm 525 and newer 500exc conversions, yamaha wr450 conversions, to ktm 690smc and husky 701sm, and even the Zero FXS.

I’ve ruled out the smaller ones as I want
the powahh, despite liking a lot of their other attributes.
I’ve ruled out the latest (2020+) 690/701 simply because i don’t want the tech.
I’ve ruled out the drz’s and xr’s because they are heavy relative to the power they produce.

I’m torn bewtween:
The 450/.../500exc’s are crazy money.
The Berg 570’s are nearly inexistant and I always worry about parts despite being mostly KTM.
The 701sm is bigger than a traditional dirtbike and reliability is unknown to me.

A good deal (case by case), fun factor, and reliability are important to me.

PS: I have previously owned a 625smc, a FS450, and a FS570. Hands down the 570 was the best in all ways. Will a 690/701 disappoint me?

If you own any type of motard, feel free to share your experience.

 

[paul cbr]

Really depends on what you're going to use it for and where you'll be riding. How far are you going and how often do you want to change oil or look at the valves? Any track days?

The 2017-2019 701s are killer "big" bikes, only tech is ABS. I loved my 2019 701SM, but they don't have a great reputation for reliability. Seems to be hit or miss.

I agree the 2020+ 701 and new 690s have too much shit.

The Honda 450L would make an easy converted motard, as well as any KTM 500EXC. Those are going to be most like your FS450 (track only?)

The FS570 is a legend... why'd you sell it?

I've owned 2x DRZs, 2x 701s and an older 690. I've ridden the old 450SMR, 610, a converted XR650R, and a bunch of others. There's lots more guys here with more SM experience.

 

[KrustyKruser]

I’ve got a 00 XR650R and enjoy it immensely. I see you don’t like the power to weight of the CRF’s and such. So I vote for a newer two stroke. See about a 2021 YZ250.

 

[chai rome]

It’s just for sporadic fun, when i want to go do tight stuff or just run around locally. I don’t mind oil changes and valve checks as long as the motor (primarily) is stout. I hate worrying about whether the bike will last or not.
As much as i like 2 strokes, they are too conspicuous for my taste.
Im really tempted by a killer deal on a 2019 701 with hardly any miles. Is it really just a gamble? Can they be reliable?

 

[chai rome]

Paul CBR,
My friend was begging for me to sell the Berg and I was weak... At least he’s kept it all these years.
Did your 701 have problems?
Is a 701sm just as fun, albeit different, as a 500/570 size motard? Not competitively speaking, just in terms of enjoyment.
Also, i find it strange that 690/701 are often recommended to people who want to put more miles on a motard yet are 500exc more reliable?
I suppose that is due to service intervals, but still...

 

[usedtobefast]

I had a Husaberg 650 motard ... oh my, oh my ... that was amazing!!! So stupid light and so stupid fast! I think it was like 252lbs or 257lbs with no fuel and with a Shorai battery in it.

I also stupidly sold it as I was worried about it having mechanical issues and parts availability. But, it was completely reliable for the time I owned it.

Then I thought a newer 690 would be similar to that 'berg ... hum, alot of that fun and rawness is missing. And they have gained like 50 lbs!

I ended up with a 2018 Duke 690. Kind of the bargain 690/701. More comfortable than the 690/701 motards, lower to the ground, suspension is a bit soft but you save so much money you could buy a better shock and get the forks done. You can find used ones in the $5K-$7k range with few miles/abuse on them.

But if you are talking WHEEEEE fun ... I am so tempted to buy another 650 Husaberg.

But if you can't do the 'berg, then the 701 without the "tech" is the more mature answer.

And you are right, skip all those 250/300/400 SMs, need more power.

 

[paul cbr]

Paul CBR,
My friend was begging for me to sell the Berg and I was weak... At least he’s kept it all these years.
Did your 701 have problems?
Is a 701sm just as fun, albeit different, as a 500/570 size motard? Not competitively speaking, just in terms of enjoyment.
Also, i find it strange that 690/701 are often recommended to people who want to put more miles on a motard yet are 500exc more reliable?
I suppose that is due to service intervals, but still...

My 701s and 690 were reliable, but I didn't put many miles on them compared to my other bikes. I ALSO foolishly sold my 701 to a friend who begged me.

If you're after a true motard, a converted 450/500 is the best way to go. The 701s have 74 HP but they also weigh a ton and you'll never get used to the fuel tank in the back. Lots of reports from guys on ADVrider of 500 EXCs being used extensively (like around the world journeys) with a bajillion miles on them. They are very reliable if you stay on top of regular maintenance.

 

[Seduction]

I am selling a set of Wr250X Wrap9 Supermoto wheels with all the conversion stuff

 

[Frame Maker]

I’ve considered all sorts of sumos; from wr250x, to klx300sm, to husky 450/510, to berg fs570, to ktm 525 and newer 500exc conversions, yamaha wr450 conversions, to ktm 690smc and husky 701sm, and even the Zero FXS...

If you own any type of motard, feel free to share your experience.

I didn't see SXV on the list so thought I'd chime in with my experience. I'll first say that I was never really interested in a sumo until a friend just by chance happened to let me ride his SXV550. What a blast! It was one of the most exciting motorcycles I've ever ridden. I had to have one so I began reading reviews of SXVs and RXVs (dual sport version). One review in particular suggested the SXV550 as being the best option for street use and RXV450 best for off-road (both are available in 550 or 450 engine sizes). At that point I knew I needed one of each.

Yes, there are stories of engine seal problems but that was limited to to the first year of production and most have been fixed by now. There are also stories of these bikes being unreliable and breaking all of the time so I had a conversation with Kregg Williams (owner of Cal Speed Sport Aprilia dealer). Kregg has several SXVs that he track rides on a regular basis. He described riding very aggressively and having very few issues if any. That said, they are maintenance intensive. I guess that should be expected from a barely street legal race bike.

Overall I love my SXV and RXV. They aren't something that I want to ride everyday and they aren't geared for highway riding. But back road canyons are a freak-n blast!

20200401_132014 by andbike, on Flickr

 

[chai rome]

I have never ridden one and probably best that I don’t; they sound so bad ass but all searches emphasized the costly issues. What kind of maintenance is required?

I found a screaming deal on a 701sm. Will update my own thread about it soon.

 

[Frame Maker]

I have never ridden one and probably best that I don’t; they sound so bad ass but all searches emphasized the costly issues. What kind of maintenance is required?

I found a screaming deal on a 701sm. Will update my own thread about it soon.

"bad ass" is accurate! The 450 is an exciting bike to ride and my favorite for poor quality East Bay back roads because of the soft off-road specific suspension. On smoother roads the SXV550 is completely insane! Its the only moto I've ever ridden that requires full concentration just to keep the front wheel connected to the ground. These bikes don't have high stop speeds, but at lower speeds they simply rip!

As for maintenance, they consume oil (even in ideal condition) and suggested oil change intervals are VERY frequent. They require a special 10W60 synthetic oil that is very expensive. The other issue I've experienced is replacement of starters. The starter motors are very small and burn out very easily. Other than that, I've not done too much other than replace some body panels, bent lever and bent bar mount after a deer strike on my SXV.

If you want a bike that will put a huge grin on your face while simultaneously scaring the shit out of you, these are amazing bikes!

 

[KooLaid]

no high top speed? You're crazy to want to go faster lol. I think I hit 114 and that was WAY more than insane fast on sxv550. At 65+ mph that air would catch my chest and it alone was enough to lighten that front wheel to be all sorts of sketchy. Stiffer springs helped but really, no desire to be going more than 85 mph.

 

[Maddevill]

If you're interested, I have a 2004 KTM 450 EXC with a 540 big bore kit.
Street legal, bored carb, 2 sets of dirt wheels, currently set up for SM with Warp9
wheels and oversized rotor. Tons of extras come with it.
Pm me if interested

Mad

 

[chai rome]

Thanks for the offer, but I’m one day away from a 701sm.
Still - it would be great to hear about people’s experiences with any model s/m - Or just pictures!

 

[somesuch]

I prefer Huky 610 to all of the above mentioned bikes as to me, it represents the best combination of reliability, maintainability, power, weight, freeway capability, etc....

610:
- is a bit over 300lbs
- has a great FCR41 carb stock
- has decent power (with aftermarket exhaust/jetting)
- has six speed trans, and cruises easily at 80, top speed could be about 110
- lasts longer than necessary (clutch basket spring washers and cam chain are the only items that need to be addressed) I have a significant body af anecdotal evidence to the 610s reliability...have seven now
- never burns any oil! I put 2 qts of Rotella 15-40 T6 in it, and drain the same after 1Kmi. Cheap oil change too
- is easy to work on - unlike some bikes on the above list
- has electric start
- is not buzzy like some bikes on the above list, has balancer shaft
- has decent suspension
- is plated from the factory...nothing sketchy
- is cheap to insure
- has longer swingarm than Husky 450/510 and has a much longer lasting motor....overall, it is better than 630 in my opinion as well

The not so good aspects of 610 ownership are:

- parts cost and availability...but you generally don't need the expensive parts
- limited range of about 100mi (2.2 gal tank and about 45-55 mpg)


Some other random thoughts:
- check the price on the 701 subframe since it is plastic and you will loop the bike
- look into fuel pump/fuel regulator/engine reliability/missed shifts/etc of the model, especially if it is KTM

 

[chai rome]

somesuch, that is great and useful info.
Had I not found such a good deal I would have surely considered the 610. I had a 625smc in the past and often heard the two were in the same spectrum - are you able to talk about it relative to the older smc’s?

Here is my new sm.
It arrived last night but I just had to ride it. Very pleased at this point. The weight does not feel bad at all. I’ve owned a Duc HM1100 and really dug the supermoto-character but the weight kept it from truly being a motard. The 701 suspension is wonderful, handling is light and precise, and the throttle is quite nice. In a nutshell, I have/had two main concerns about this bike;
1) is it fun, i.e., does it feel like a supermoto? yes
2) will it be reliable? tbd... I understand most
are saying break-in is key.

 

[chai rome]

2019 701SM

welcome

 

[paul cbr]

Nice! I loved both of my 701s...
2 things to do right away: slip-on and Oberon clutch slave.
The stock can has the cat inside of it and it gets super hot. Like dangerously hot. And the stock slave will fail at some point. Some last 10k miles, others blow the internal seal at 10 miles. Easy to replace now for a few bucks.

 

[chai rome]

Thanks. I’ll take a look at the clutch slave. I’d rather keep the exhaust stock for money (exhaust+fuel tubing) and noise. I do have the Rottweiler fuel dongle to install.

 

[Map8]

Congratulations on the new ride!