Thinking of giving up riding after near miss

[Holeshot]

Remember, we do not have to split lanes. If we choose to do so, we don't have to split to the very front. We certainly don't need to be the first vehicle into the intersection.

Really good points T. I was thinking the same thing. I don't split to the front many times for this reason.

 

[Darkness!]

Let me preface this with saying that every situation is...well, situational. Meaning, that it's easy to be an armchair coach after the fact. Having said that, It looks as if the van was pretty clearly not slowing down and you assumed it would. While it wasn't following that close behind the black Tesla SUV, it seems fairly obvious that it wasn't going to come to a stop. As someone else stated, it looks as if you moved into the lane the van was already (still) occupying and the driver moved left to avoid you. Granted, the van driver made a questionable decision to keep going, but you also moved out into the intersection without noticing it wasn't braking. To be honest, while it might have been a bit scary, I would suggest trying to be objective about how you could improve your situational awareness, learning from it, and keep on motoring. I definitely wouldn't quit riding or sell my bike because of something like that. YMMV. I don't know your life situation so I'm not here to judge anything about whatever decision you make. I would say, pretty much every one of us riders on this forum that ride regularly and commute on our bikes have all had similar situations come up from time to time. Just the nature of riding in a densely packed urban area.

 

[ST Guy]

I would always split to the front. But I was always careful to make sure no one was running a red when I took off. Always safe for nearly 40 years.

 

[tzrider]

On the matter of situational awareness, I don’t know if we all have the same capacity for managing attention that way. Those who can do it tend to imagine that everyone else can, “if they just work on it.”

That might be true. It might not be. TryIng on the latter idea, if a person cannot be more aware, they are inevitably going to be surprised in this way again. If I felt that way, I might conclude that I’m better off not riding too. The crux for the OP is, do you see the possibility of managing attention at moments like this to minimize the chance of being surprised? I think it’s possible, but I only have my own experience to go by.

 

[berth]

That might be true. It might not be. TryIng on the latter idea, if a person cannot be more aware, they are inevitably going to be surprised in this way again.

But there's fundamental cognitive capacity, and there's unintentional blind spots and potentially bad behaviors.

In this case, the rider looked left, watched the light turn green, and then turned right, without looking back before actually entering traffic.

If that's something they always do, then maybe they weren't aware of it. As seen here, that can be demonstrably less safe. If they're conscious now of that lack of a head turn, perhaps they can say to themselves at the light "one more look" before going and potentially train/habituate themselves out of that behavior.

But if they don't know the issue exists in the first place, there's not much they can do to remedy a problem they don't know they have.

 

[Cabrito]

@berth said - In this case, the rider looked left, watched the light turn green, and then turned right, without looking back before actually entering traffic.

^^^ This is what I saw after watching the video at .25 speed several times to be sure. I think it looked like the rider was sitting in the crosswalk which is something I do myself, but try to avoid it for the most part. It doesn't leave much room for double checking before taking off.

I'll add that complacency is a real issue when we ride the same routes everyday. I got caught several years ago waiting for my left turn arrow and jumped right when it turned green. I felt the wind of the red light runner as he flew past me and almost took me out. I surely would have died if he'd hit me. I took a few weeks off after that to get my shit together.

I commute across the city on my bike and almost triple check the intersections when the lights change out of habit and muscle memory. When I start to get sloppy I take some time off the bike.

 

[anytwowilldo]

I've ridden for decades and have suffered through years of 90 minute one way commutes in cars as I simply have never considered commuting on my moto. I feel it is just too dangerous. People are at the worst in commute traffic and it's just too easy to get hit. My advice is commute in a cage, ride your moto on remote roads for fun.

 

[Kysh]

30 year combat commuter (with a few breaks).

My thoughts?

Don't ever, ever, ever trust a cager. Don't put yourself in a situation where they can hit you. Don't rely on being seen, or on other people following the law. Especially at intersections, places where cars are turning left. A car parked on the side of the road is about to whip a blind 180° U-turn without looking. A car at a driveway is about to just floor it and pull out while staring (you think) right at you and making eye contact. A car in a lane that's slowing dramatically is half a breath away from making a desperate lunge to the left or right to go into a lane that's moving faster, who cares what's already there.

Ride as if everyone is out to kill you, and put yourself in a position where they can't. It's not paranoia, it's survival.

In OP's video, the last look left came before the light was even red. You can't be too paranoid at intersections. People will happily kill you if it means getting home a minute sooner. They may not even know what the bump they felt was, or that dragging sound.

My 3¥

 

[WFO]

I was always into dirt bikes and never had any serious injuries until I was well into my thirties. I highly recommend riding dirt bikes to develop your skills.

I got this TT 500 when I was 17:

I did a few things to it and got it licensed. This was in 1981. It was a lot of fun, but I crashed on it a lot. Crashing on the street really sucks for many obvious reasons. I kept it for a number of years. It handled great on the street, but it was easy to overcook it in corners since it was underpowered. I got pretty good at doing power wheelies (I could never master the balance point.) and pitching the rear end through corners. It was a pig in the dirt.

A few noteworthy incidents:

There's a hairpin on 9 below the upper junction with 236. Going uphill, you could go off the pavement and use the shale on the hillside as a big banked turn. One day the bars swapped at the bottom, and the bike spit me out into the street. I was lucky there wasn't a car there. It wasn't fun riding home with my torn jacket sleeve flapping in the breeze against the road rash on my elbow.

I looped it out one day clicking into 5th gear. That was painful and expensive.

There was an uphill hairpin in Redwood Estates with a big fir tree on the inside. It's roots had encroached into the pavement. If you squared off the corner on the outside, you could hit the root and catch air - big fun! Until one day there was a bunch of loose gravel on the edge of the pavement that I hit. The front end washed out. In my disbelief, I neglected to stick my foot out and just lowsided. It dragged my foot along the pavement taking the tongue out of my Nikes and some skin along with it.

A few weeks later, I had just left my house, and there were a number of people hanging out in a nearby turnout. I figured I would show off and hot dog it around this right-hand corner. I forgot that it helps to have warm tires. The rear end came around at about 50mph. I new I was fucked and just leaned it over until it lowsided. I was sliding down the road on my ass, and steered my way into a culvert. Miraculously, I didn't get hurt. The bike was laying in the middle of the road going thump, thump, thump still running with the rear wheel spinning around off the ground. I looked myself over and noticed that my jacket sleeve was torn, and that seemed to be the extent of it. The people in the turnout started running my way so I waved may arms and yelled, "I'm okay!" The only damage to the bike was both brake levers were ground down. I went home and then found out the rear pocket of my jeans was missing along with my wallet. I went back to the scene, and found my wallet laying in the culvert. All the money and credit cards had been ground through. My wallet literally saved my ass.

I then figured this bike would eventually kill me so I decided to sell it to a buddy for $500. I think that was around 1985. (I'm kicking myself now.)

I started riding on the street again about twenty years later. A friend let me borrow his CBR900RR for a ride down the coast to LA. It was a blast. I had to get one of these. I ended up buying an '02 VFR800. It was an okay bike - somewhat mediocre, but it was a decent sport-tourer.

One day I was driving home from my job at Stanford going up 84 because the traffic on 280 sucked. When I got up to Skyline, there was a semi with Ducati emblazoned on it parked in front of Alice's. They were loading a bunch of Hyperstradas into it. Of course I had to stop and check it out. The guy told me if I showed up the next day with my gear and M1 license, I could take one for a spin. Who could resist? So the next day, I took one for a ride and decided I needed to sell my shitty Honda.

Ducatis are amazing machines.

A friend once showed up at a house I was renting in Los Gatos. This was in the early '90s. He was on an '88 851 Superbike. He asked me if I wanted to try it out. It was a hot summer day. I was wearing shorts and flip flops. I grabbed my helmet and hopped on it. It bugged me how the bars didn't turn very far. It was a bitch turning it around in the driveway. I took it for a spin around Vasona. As I was cruising down University Ave next to the lake, I looked down at the speedometer and noticed I was effortlessly doing 130mph. This was somewhat unnerving so I decide to slow down. I got on the freeway to head back home. It's a clover leaf. Coming out of the corner and getting onto the freeway, I was already doing 100mph before I got under the bridge. I wasn't used to this. it's really incredible how these things get going so fast so fast.

I ended up buying a 2012 Multistrada with the Öhlins suspension. This bike is a lot of fun. I got pitched on it a little bit yesterday on the way up Old San Jose/Soquel in some wet stuff on the road. It was pretty uneventful. Whenever it gets loose, (either end) it always comes right back. It's amazing how far you can lean it into corners.

I haven't crashed on the street in over thirty-five years. (Knock on wood!) One thing I've learned to do is ride smoothly and maintain lots of distance between myself and others on the road. That helps give me time to react to all of the idiocy. Every now and then, I feel the effects of the high and it gets the better of me. Drive fast and take chances. So far, I've been pretty lucky. I've never raced on pavement. I ride with guys who are much faster and skillful than I am.

Motorcycling is dangerous. I might die on my bike, but that wouldn't be a bad way to go if it happens quickly.

Everyone should know their own limitations and act accordingly. Good luck with your decision.

 

[huskymorework]

+1 for lightning strikes...it sucks. You could always try taking a little time without doing anything drastic. You may find you miss it and engage with the idea of risk differently after a few weeks. Or maybe that grows into the feeling of the right decision. It doesn't have to be immediately binary. I have often found the middle ground is more honest. Depending on how your life works you may still be able to ride without being on the street.

 

[marcdanziger]

So commuting back from work today a White Chevrolet Van (plate 37393N2) ran a red light and it was a near miss (video here:

). I was trying to think what I could have done differently here and the only thing I came up with was: instead of pulling up in front of the row of cars, wait behind the 1st car and follow it on green.

But then I saw my other commute videos and there are cases where I need to stay in the left most lane (because I have to turn left at the next light). In those cases, if I filter (at a red light) and wait behind the 1st car, then on green, if the lane on right of me goes faster, I've seen people get impatient and I bet some morons will try to pass me. So waiting behind the 1st car is a no go.

That pretty much leaves me with no filtering to the front and that's even more riskier with rear end collisions and will also leave me soaked in sweat waiting in my gear. I guess that leaves me with, stop commuting on motorcycle ? Thoughts ?

FWIW, I built a habit early on riding in SoCal where lights are 'recommendations' - before I pull out I head check left then right and _really look_ to see if there are approaching vehicles. That both gives me information and prevents me from squirting out quickly as soon as the light changes.

I now do it even when driving The Stupid Truck(tm) and it's actually saved me from more than one runner.

 

[Das MotorRad]

FWIW, I built a habit early on riding in SoCal where lights are 'recommendations' - before I pull out I head check left then right and _really look_ to see if there are approaching vehicles. That both gives me information and prevents me from squirting out quickly as soon as the light changes.

I now do it even when driving The Stupid Truck(tm) and it's actually saved me from more than one runner.

Something similar but different; after really looking both ways, I zoom out and maintain a wide-field view. This has saved me multiple times both riding and driving.

This week during heavy fog at night, very low visibility, a small suv pulled out in front of me while driving with my wife. Because I was driving zoomed out with a wide field of view I was able to let off the gas and barely needed to touch the brakes. I saw them out of the corner of my eye and easily avoided a collision. My wife was really shaken up "Why didn't you honk at them?!" Well for one, honking takes time away from reacting, and two, it would have introduced another variable (startling a driver could result in them smashing on the brakes.)

 

[ST Guy]

One must be constantly checking around them to avoid trouble. Ahead, to both sides, and to the rear.

 

[planegray]

My habits:

I always split to the front
As I'm waiting for my green light to come, I keep my head turned to the left. After the light turns green, I start my departure while looking to my left and scanning for the first most dangerous threat to me, with that scan done, I move my head to the right to scan for the second most dangerous threat to me. Meanwhile, I try to stay somewhat between the cars so they can protect me. Once I feel I am safe from red light runners, I will go ahead and accelerate away from the pack.
This all happens in a 3 to 4 ft distance.

 

[greenmonster]

I’m the opposite. I almost never split to the front at traffic lights. Whenever I do I feel obligated to jackrabbit away on the green so I don’t block the car I just got in front of.
This makes me easy bait for red light runners so I don’t it.

Besides, my riding style these days is to cruise and relax, not race ahead.

 

[zanshin]

I was just reading the above and flashed back to an event a few years back. I drove (and rode) the length of 97 between Weed and Biggs Junction countless times over decades of back and forth travel between CA and Inland Northwest.. and one fine day I was descending past Shasta, heavy truck and trailer doing 70 realistically, going right past this spot.. where some passenger car pulls out right in front of me.

And I don't mean an inconsiderate move requiring me to brake hard, but mere carlengths as I'm bearing down, 50 feet long and running bright amber DRLs that you can see from the next county. He was sitting there at the stop sign and waited for some seconds as I approached - everything seemed normal - and then pulled out when I was on top of the intersection. In well over a million miles, I have never experienced anything quite at this level of "Ima step out in front of an oncoming train" insanity.


There was oncoming traffic so I flowed around this fool on the shoulder, not even touching the brake to keep the weight distribution favorable for swerving, focusing on keeping the trailer in shape. Hopefully pelted the shit out of him with gravel. Whoever was in that car, was a second away from dying, and possibly yours truly and others as this would have likedly cascaded into head-ons and rollover.

I will say that a lifetime of motorsports shenanigans saved the day there -- no freezing, no shock, just immediate flow, and then shaking my head and wondering what in the actual fuck that was while carrying on as normal. I think if my Zoomer kid were driving, that would have been it. Too few years of automotive stress inoculation -- not enough track time, no heavy commuting experience. We're doing another three day father-son car event in Feb, so working on it.

HNY!

 

[zanshin]

Wellp, another year and another good 3-day session on the ice. We had two former Junior WRC world champs from Sweden, now retired from competition, to emulate. I think next year we might skip Wisconsin and go to Sweden earlier in the season for more of the same.

Insofar as the fun factor, I like this better than dirt rally -- no safety equipment, no trees to smack or ditches to end up in. It's low intensity, low risk, and is a total hoot. Fairly consistent low traction on top quality studded tires, so one can (and should, and must) remain sideways at all times other than for a little straight or two, connecting all linked corners with pendulums. And the way the courses are laid out, most corners are connected, so it's just a never ending pendulumgasm. Kid's getting the hang of it!


View attachment 1772525832812.jpeg

p.s. Pastrana was out there having fun after we'd already gone, but it looks a bit slow even for RWD. Perhaps no good options for studded rubber in that wheel size, and it just can't hook up.

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

 

[budman]

Looks fun. Lucky you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!