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When you least expect it...

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Outta Control said:
Yup. I mostly buy used. ;) My last new bike was my 07 Gixxer. Get her fixed up and ride some more.
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Based on my conversations with the folks at BMW yesterday, I don't think it's going to be leaving that shop under its own power.
 
Kornholio said:
I'm confused, Tim. Are you saying I did or did not ride defensively in this case?
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No. My comment was in regards to jc2ducati's post(s).

Given the results of this incident, what will you do differently if/when you find yourself in a similar situation? How will you adjust your position, speed, and awareness level?

Let keep this thread dedicated to analysis of the crash in an effort to help learn from the event.
 
Outta Control said:
You mean it will have a salvage title?
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I mean I'm expecting it to be totaled. So yes.

Enchanter said:
No. My comment was in regards to jc2ducati's post(s).

Given the results of this incident, what will you do differently if/when you find yourself in a similar situation? How will you adjust your position, speed, and awareness level?
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I think there can be a level of complacency when using two-way left turn lanes. In my particular case (as referenced in the picture above) the two-way turn lane I entered turns into a dedicated left turn lane and I think that's where the other party assumed he was clear to enter without bothering to ensure that the two-way turn lane was clear of traffic. The vehicle code allows for a vehicle to travel for no more than 200 feet in two-way turn lanes before either exiting or executing a left turn. So while I did enter the two-way left turn lane well less than 200 feet before the dedicated left turn lane, there really wasn't a reason for me to do it except that there was a lot of traffic that I was just choosing to avoid. I had made the same maneuver many times in the past so I thought nothing of doing it again in this case. Going forward, I don't think I'd do this again. I'd just wait until the turn lane opens up.

Of course, that doesn't eliminate the possibility of someone violating my right of way in the dedicated turn lane either so the other learning lesson here is, once again, don't become complacent and assume that other drivers are going to yield the right of way or bother to check their blind spots. Obviously this is something I practiced on a regular basis while riding, but not necessarily as much when it came to this particular intersection. I've lived here long enough to study (by traveling through it) how that intersection tends to work, but that doesn't mean things can't change in a moments notice. The guy that hit me was new to the area and, from what it appeared to the officer and myself, was planning on executing a U-turn from the position he turned out and made contact with me.

Folks, always expect the unexpected and never take your eye off the ball! :2cents
 
Enchanter said:
You and I can both cite multiple times that people looked right at us and still pulled into our path, so using the looked into their eyes theory for riding safely, is just foolish.

It comes down to the risk-to-reward. Eliminating the (time &) space to react is not the wisest choice.

I do agree that there are times that protecting the lane is smart, but this isn't one of them.
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If maximizing time and space is your priority, then lane-splitting would be considered risky and foolish, too. I think lots of people would agree lane-splitting inches from another car is actually safer in some cases than "maximizing space" between yourself and another car.

It's just a suggestion for one more tool for the toolbox, just like lane splitting.

However, i just read that there was a 2-way turn lane, which is a totally different scenario than what i thought. I thought it was a dedicated turn lane instead of a 2-way turn lane. Those are dangerous for cars and bikes!
 
jc2ducati said:
If maximizing time and space is your priority, then lane-splitting would be considered risky and foolish, too. I think lots of people would agree lane-splitting inches from another car is actually safer in some cases than "maximizing space" between yourself and another car.

It's just a suggestion for one more tool for the toolbox, just like lane splitting.

However, i just read that there was a 2-way turn lane, which is a totally different scenario than what i thought. I thought it was a dedicated turn lane instead of a 2-way turn lane. Those are dangerous for cars and bikes!
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It was a two-way left turn lane that turns into a dedicated turn lane. A bit of a-typical situation I'll admit. I can't think of another place I've seen one.
 
jc2ducati said:
If maximizing time and space is your priority, then lane-splitting would be considered risky and foolish, too. I think lots of people would agree lane-splitting inches from another car is actually safer in some cases than "maximizing space" between yourself and another car.

It's just a suggestion for one more tool for the toolbox, just like lane splitting.

However, i just read that there was a 2-way turn lane, which is a totally different scenario than what i thought. I thought it was a dedicated turn lane instead of a 2-way turn lane. Those are dangerous for cars and bikes!
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We can go round and round here pulling hypothetical situations out of our asses until our bowels are empty.

I suggest that it is more prudent to analyze opinions based actual risk rather than current riding habits, or the risk of other hypothetical situations.
 
Kornholio said:
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He hit me on the left turn signal/mirror...
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I'm confused about the sides...

1. In your diagram the truck was to your right. The truck moved left, and hit you on your right side, but you said above that he hit you on the "left" turn signal/mirror?

2. You got hit on the rigth side; the bike didn't fall on its left, but on its right? How - did the bike spin around 180 degrees before going down on its right?
 
Jason, glad to hear you're okay. Sorry to hear about your bike.

There are plenty of San Diego roads like that. I regularly ride one like that. Not only do I wait until the pocket opens to merge left, I have to watch out for the cars peeling a left turn out of the condo driveway on the left, just before the pocket.
 
Do you think there was any room in the turn lane for you to have been even more in the leftmost part of that lane?

Would that have helped?

+1 to "making eye contact" as being a useless defense mechanism though that has no bearing on this crash.
 
Jason, I am truly sorry that this happened to you. doesn't sound like the bike is going to pull through. The main thing is that you are OK.

I have never liked those 2-way turn lanes; I have seen cages crash into each other in these things on numerous occasions as a result of carelessness, which is what this sounded like. I don't know if three was much else you could have done, short of just hang in the traffic a bit longer before getting to the only lane.

They say that accidents occur as a result of a series of events that combine to cause the final incident. I just don't see that here; I just see a careless driver that did a stupid thing.
 
That's pretty much what happened and he admitted to not seeing me because he pretty much didn't look.

Lesson learned for me: avoid two-way turn lanes whenever possible.
 
I'm curious, and you may not have the answer: was the truck pulling into the two-way turn lane to make a lefthand turn before the dedicated lefthand turn lane opened up, or was it using the two-way turn lane to get around traffic and get up to the dedicated turn lane?
 
kongjie said:
I'm curious, and you may not have the answer: was the truck pulling into the two-way turn lane to make a lefthand turn before the dedicated lefthand turn lane opened up, or was it using the two-way turn lane to get around traffic and get up to the dedicated turn lane?
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I honestly don't know. I never asked him that question. Maybe the cop did. Weird thing was, he lives on MCAS Miramar and after our encounter, he didn't continue traveling in the direction he was facing. He took off back towards Miramar. Perhaps he was flipping a quick U...maybe he was lost? I just don't know.
 
Is there any possibility that instead of braking (which of course is usually the most natural response), you could of given yourself a small speed boost as soon as you noticed him moving and gone further left, on the yellow line without crossing it? Looks to me like that black square is a bit ahead of you but also possible that you wouldn't have enough space or time to do even that, considering human response time. I guess if you would of sped up he was going to end up hitting you at a different angle.

It sounds to me that you are very lucky there was no oncoming traffic and that you missed getting double whammied.
 
Yeah oncoming traffic would've probably been a death knell for me. Hitting the throttle probably wouldn't have helped much considering he would've just hit me further back and potentially spun me around into his grille.
 
What a beautiful bike. I'm sorry to hear about it being down and out. Thanks for posting your experience and analysis.

Question: Did the other vehicle make any contact with your leg or any other part of your body?
 
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